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Post by horseguy on Dec 19, 2016 13:56:20 GMT
I think a class on horseness needs an underlying theme, a trademark standard that exemplifies the meaning and purpose of what horseness is about. And here is the principle - attention. It's all about what part attention plays in the nature of horses.
The opening statement of class one would be, "Unlike humans, horses possess a remarkable ability to focus their attention through all their sensual input channels at once". What would follow is an explanation of how a herd functions, which horses pay attention and which ones don't. For example, in a typical herd on a sunny day the older and younger horses have a tendency to lie on the ground and rest. While they are resting, other horses pay great attention to the surroundings as if given the task of surveillance. Should a threat arrive, the "guard" horse or horses bolt and thus startle the rest of the horses into leaving. These "guard" horses use sight, sound, touch (i.e. feel vibrations in the ground), and smell to identify threats. They pay attention in a sensually broader way than humans and, I believe, in a more focused way than humans. And that's the point, horses have an unusual combination of depth and breadth of attention that is difficult for humans to comprehend.
And then humans come along.
Imagine a being genetically programed to pay attention to their surroundings, the horse, in a manner exponentially greater than your own. And then imagine another kind of being, humans, focusing their unfamiliar brand of attention on you, a horse. This unfamiliar type of being makes odd and distracting sounds. They act in ways that are incomprehensibly tedious. You hear these odd actions describe as "cuddling". They offer strangely intense tasting treats (peppermints) and constantly bring big garment kinds of things, which they drape over your body robbing you of the sensation of the wind. The list of their invasive acts, sounds, tastes, and mannerisms is overwhelming. This human behavior overrides your ability to function as an equine being programed to pay attention by forcing you to receive attention.
This is the underlying principle of the classes. Humans are taught that their role is to receive attention from the horse and to refrain from inundating the horse with human attention, which blocks the horse's natural process of awareness. Furthermore, students are taught that if the horse's process of attentiveness is overwhelmed over a long enough period, the horse will lose it's natural attention ability, focus and purpose, and that puts a horse adrift, intellectually, physically and emotionally, in terms of their natural purpose. Putting a horse adrift in this way can make a horse dangerous. It can also make them exceedingly dull or it can make them into something else that is unpredictable or crazy.
Students would be taught that their "loving attention" toward their horse is not only not appreciated (although over time horses will learn to respond as if they enjoy it). Human attention acts like the equivalent of a radar jamming signal that is uncomfortable in the least and destructive at worst. Students learn that they must learn to work within a horse's realm of attention paid, and cease imposing the human inclination to feel valued by means of forcing attention onto other beings. |
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Post by jimmy on Dec 19, 2016 15:02:52 GMT
Your first concept is: Paying attention vs. receiving attention.
That's a good start.
In fact just yesterday, I was explaining to my boss, who was wondering what I was trying to teach his horses when I ride them, that mostly I work on them paying attention to the rider, when asked for attention.
However, I will note, that whenever I am in the pasture, and my horses come to visit me, I make a big deal of it. I find there is an itchy spot between their jaw bones that scratching it is like candy to them.
Horses do visit one another, and seek each other out. Sometimes just so they can get the flies swatted off of them, or sometimes to play. I don't advise playing with a horse, like they play with one another. But they do come to visit, sometimes looking for a treat, or, they like to be scratched and rubbed on, at some point. Makes them easier to catch too.
The difference is I do not insist they accept my affection. Some horses are all business, and can become irritated when it is forced on them. some horses would rather be left alone, and that's okay. But I always present the idea to them, and evaluate the response.
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Post by horseguy on Dec 19, 2016 15:50:47 GMT
"... whenever I am in the pasture, and my horses come to visit me, I make a big deal of it. I find there is an itchy spot between their jaw bones that scratching it is like candy to them ... I do not insist they accept my affection. Some horses are all business, and can become irritated when it is forced on them. some horses would rather be left alone, and that's okay. But I always present the idea to them, and evaluate the response." My take on you scratching the horse is you are giving him a stimulus to pay attention too, which is very different than how most people impose their self absorbed ego attention on a horse. The key difference is " I do not insist they accept my affection". It is in that kind of insisting that horses become confused, disoriented, irritated and sometimes crazy. This is a critical subtlety in teaching the nature of horses to humans. You a can offer attention to a horse but it must be presented in a way that the horse is permitted to stay within their natural programing to pay attention. That requires self awareness or mindfulness and therein lies the challenge. |
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Post by jimmy on Dec 19, 2016 16:45:35 GMT
The scratching is like giving them a treat, only better. They go up to one another head to tail so that the other horse's tail will keep flies off their face. There also is a small amount of mutual grooming, chewing on the withers, you see.
But if they see this person in the pasture, the guy who scratches that itch, they might come on over.
The point being, it should feel good to a horse to be around a person, and to be ridden and handled. He should want to be there, even though in reality we force them to be with us, because we need them to ride and jump and catch cows,etc.
We just have to figure out what is really feeling good to the horse, rather than inventing false ideas of what feels good to them, like the forced affection put on them.
I think what feels the best to them is to be comfortable and free of fear.
That doesn't mean we can scratch and pet our horses into submission. We eventually have to introduce our horse to fearful situations and certain crisis, in order for them to really hold together for us, and be reliable.
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Post by horseguy on Dec 19, 2016 17:42:02 GMT
... That doesn't mean we can scratch and pet our horses into submission. We eventually have to introduce our horse to fearful situations and certain crisis, in order for them to really hold together for us, and be reliable. The line between effective offering of attention to a horse and imposing it is difficult to see. It is most often clouded by a person's need to feel of value to the horse. The result is typically a blanket that is too warm or the equivalent. We become "too" everything to our horses, which in the end becomes a deficit for them of what they need. I was thinking about that 7 year old I was leading yesterday that didn't know how to spook in place. He over reacted big time to a door in the barn opening and a brush up against another horse in the aisle. At 7 years old this should not be. Imagine the angst this horse constantly feels. But if you told the owners that they had neglected him, they would argue intensely that they have done the best by him. Eventually we do "have to introduce our horse to fearful situations" and yet many horse owner spend incredible time and energy avoiding those realities. The end result is the horse becomes unmanageable and worthless. It bounces around from rescue to auction with no human caring for it at all. This result in the mind of the first owner(s) who spoiled him is it's all been done out of love. |
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Post by jimmy on Dec 19, 2016 20:00:53 GMT
The other concept is that there are times, especially with a young horse, that he gets fearful or uncomfortable. Things don't feel too good to him. This is where some might try and sooth him by petting. I just recognize that at that moment the horse doesn't feel too good inside. There isn't always anything to do but to carry on, and keep him just the safe side of trouble. The confidence gained by a confident and casual acting handler, is more important than the person who feels the horse needs a hug.
I actually asked someone recently, when they tried to sooth a horse that balked or spooked at something., if they thought the horse needed a hug. "Do you think your horse needs a hug?" They say they just want to help them. So I tell them, the best help is the confidence you give them by acting like nothing is wrong.
Horseguy, I think I have been teaching your class for years, actually! LOL
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Post by horseguy on Dec 19, 2016 23:14:44 GMT
The other concept is that there are times, especially with a young horse, that he gets fearful or uncomfortable. Things don't feel too good to him. This is where some might try and sooth him by petting. I just recognize that at that moment the horse doesn't feel too good inside. There isn't always anything to do but to carry on, and keep him just the safe side of trouble. The confidence gained by a confident and casual acting handler, is more important than the person who feels the horse needs a hug. I actually asked someone recently, when they tried to sooth a horse that balked or spooked at something., if they thought the horse needed a hug. "Do you think your horse needs a hug?" They say they just want to help them. So I tell them, the best help is the confidence you give them by acting like nothing is wrong. Horseguy, I think I have been teaching your class for years, actually! LOL I think you have been teaching it too and when I build my ranch in Colorado that cost students $1,000 a day to visit for advanced classes and certifications, you can come teach there and get rich with me. We can make movies and sell books & DVDs. |
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Post by horseguy on Dec 19, 2016 23:20:46 GMT
The other concept is that there are times, especially with a young horse, that he gets fearful or uncomfortable. Things don't feel too good to him. This is where some might try and sooth him by petting. I just recognize that at that moment the horse doesn't feel too good inside. There isn't always anything to do but to carry on, and keep him just the safe side of trouble. The confidence gained by a confident and casual acting handler, is more important than the person who feels the horse needs a hug. I actually asked someone recently, when they tried to sooth a horse that balked or spooked at something., if they thought the horse needed a hug. "Do you think your horse needs a hug?" They say they just want to help them. So I tell them, the best help is the confidence you give them by acting like nothing is wrong. Horseguy, I think I have been teaching your class for years, actually! LOL
I think you have been teaching it too and when I build my ranch in Colorado that cost students $1,000 a day to visit for advanced classes and certifications, you can come teach there and get rich with me. We can make movies and sell books & DVDs.
I think this point is very important, "There isn't always anything to do but to carry on ...". That is a huge insight that so many people refuse to consider much less do. When a horse in training gets uncomfortable at something specific, like at the new barn there is a metal grate in the paved driveway that spooks nearly every horse I have ridden by it, I do it over and over again. Riding past that grate is part of every ride I do. Yes it's uncomfortable, until it's not. Horses need to be left to deal internally with their fears most of the time. Our job is to keep them involved in those fears in a way that they become unimportant.
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Post by horseguy on Dec 20, 2016 13:19:30 GMT
As I turn this horseness idea over in my mind I see sometimes that the classes would be unnecessary if people just observed horses. Jimmy mentioned this earlier. He said we can't always know but we can observe and learn something. These thoughts lead me to a place where I see the challenge is with the people. They don't see. Why? Too hurried a life? Too caught in the humanness? Why did the bird people start the classes and why are they still going and people are taking them? Are bird owners that different than horse owners? I always end up back at my beginning, a boy sent to a military man's stable, often for five riding lessons per week because his family could afford it and his mother wanted his energy gone from her home. There at that all business stable I was told (told in the sense that this is the absolute truth) that horses had a purpose. My teacher saw himself, as many cavalry men did, as saving a useful tradition that would return to the Army someday, mounted soldiers. And he was right. Now every special forces school graduate spends some time at Ft. Collins learning to ride in case their mission requires it.  It comes down to purpose. And as posted earlier, the process is about attention. We have to pay attention if we are to get to a real purpose. We have to pay attention in terms of observing what works. The classes are for people who see attention in a whole different way. For them attention is more like watering a plant or polishing shoes. Yes, there is some of that kind of attention in horsemanship, but by far most of its application is in observing what works, and for that the horseman must be referencing a purpose. |
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Post by jacki on Dec 20, 2016 15:39:59 GMT
"attention in [horsemanship], ... its application is in observing what works, and .... must be referencing a purpose." Well said, and I think you could substitute many different words for "horsemanship" and the idea would be true, for both instructors and students -- attention to what is working in the context of an overall purpose. Committees of all kinds, from youth groups to athletic departments, etc. are routinely tasked with preparing both a VISION statement and a MISSION statement. The mission statement sets goals for teaching/learning, all within the context of the vision statement, the "why" behind what they do. I think you would have an uphill battle in holding a successful horseness class -- 1) focus, or real attention, seems to be a problem with the current generation; and 2) I think "old school" instructors like you and Jimmy would have a vastly different vision of the desired outcome of the class.
The lack of focus or useful attention I chalk up to an "addiction" to digital media. People have real trouble dealing with "down time" these days - very easily bored. With more time spent at the barn and away from the "tech" I think that could be improved. With all the mass marketing, lowered training standards, wide access 24/7 to "experts" of dubious credentials, etc, advancing your vision or purpose I think will be a much more difficult challenge.
"I think you have been teaching it too and when I build my ranch in Colorado that cost students $1,000 a day to visit for advanced classes and certifications, you can come teach there and get rich with me. We can make movies and sell books & DVDs." -- I think you guys should just start with the books & DVD's and a good marketing firm! Marketing seems to be what sells these days, not content. Good luck!
Jacki
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Post by jimmy on Dec 20, 2016 19:55:42 GMT
The problem with the flood of digital world of instant information overload, is that not everyone is getting the same set of facts to work from.
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Post by horseguy on Dec 21, 2016 12:52:56 GMT
There was an old quote, "You can have your own opinions but you can't have your own facts." I do not believe that is true anymore, and having your own "facts" empowers everyone, including kids, to fee entitled to some level of respect that often makes them unteachable. For example with starting this drill team, I have seen several times how people think it is beneath them. Not worth the $30 session coaching and arena use fee. To me that's cheap. But they cannot perceive value if they have a completely unsupportable, in terms of action, concept of their riding. They can't ride but they think they can. This is a change in the general riding population I have seen grow over the past 20 years. The end result is it creates a downward spiral of equestrian expectation and ability. Do you remember at the last barn where I was not allowed to ride down into the creek and out because it was "too dangerous" Fot the people who ran the barn maybe, but not for a decent rider. This is how it works now - pretend you can ride, find things to do that confirm your pretend ability, then oppose anything that might shatter that made up reality. This is how personal "facts" are maintained in the equestrian world today. It's why American hunts are hiring Irish riders to Staff their hunts and manage their packs in a chase, why we now struggle to stay in the top 10 in international eventing competition, and a lot more.
Fixing all this begins with American riders gaining a concrete understanding of the nature of a horse and of the complete range of what a horse is capable of doing. Both are nearly lost completely here in America now.
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